Order's status ("valid") is not acceptable for finalization

futureweb · March 18, 2020, 10:54am

Hey there,
using https://github.com/analogic/lescript as LE Client in our CMS.
Lately it’s throwing those 403 Errors from time to time:

403
{
  "type": "urn:ietf:params:acme:error:orderNotReady",
  "detail": "Order's status ("valid") is not acceptable for finalization",
  "status": 403
}

I’m not quite sure why it’s throwing it … as far as I understand the Protocoll this is thrown when I try to finalize the Order more than once - but there is only 1 call for finalization I’m firing … ?

How can I get this Status in return on the first fall fo /finalize/? Any ideas on that?
Thank you, bye from sunny Austria
Andreas

JuergenAuer · March 18, 2020, 11:55am

Hi @futureweb

your order must be "ready", not valid. Wait some seconds.

futureweb · March 18, 2020, 12:16pm

Hi @JuergenAuer,
why I’m a bit puzzled (what I don’t understand) is why it’s returning VALID - isn’t valid returned AFTER the Cert has already been issued according to the RFC?

https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/rfc8555/?include_text=1

  o  "invalid": The certificate will not be issued.  Consider this
      order process abandoned.

   o  "pending": The server does not believe that the client has
      fulfilled the requirements.  Check the "authorizations" array for
      entries that are still pending.

   o  "ready": The server agrees that the requirements have been
      fulfilled, and is awaiting finalization.  Submit a finalization
      request.

   o  "processing": The certificate is being issued.  Send a POST-as-GET
      request after the time given in the Retry-After header field of
      the response, if any.

   o  "valid": The server has issued the certificate and provisioned its
      URL to the "certificate" field of the order.  Download the
      certificate.

9peppe · March 18, 2020, 12:19pm

So valid means finalization was done already, why are you finalizing again?

Download the certificate.

futureweb · March 18, 2020, 12:21pm

@9peppe … that’s the thing … I don’t finalize a second time … it’s returned on the FIRST finalization call … that’s why I’m puzzled as I don’t expect a VALID back with a 403 Status …

9peppe · March 18, 2020, 12:27pm

Ok, help me navigate your code. Which line is throwing that error?

Hint: https://www.php.net/manual/en/function.debug-print-backtrace.php

futureweb · March 18, 2020, 12:30pm

it’s thrown in the curl() function - which is called by signedRequest() which again is called by this line …

   $finalizeResponse = $this->signedRequest($finalizeUrl, array('csr' => $csr));

Error thrown here in the curl() Func:

if ($this->lastCode >= 400 && $this->lastCode < 600) {
     throw new RuntimeException($this->lastCode."\n".$body);
}

JuergenAuer · March 18, 2020, 12:48pm

I don't know when you see that error.

What's the output of your order url before that command is started?

9peppe · March 18, 2020, 1:13pm

can you show us some logs, too?

what puzzles me is that how on earth is the order getting finalized without posting a csr? is it possible your code doesn’t actually get a new order but always reuses the same?

futureweb · March 18, 2020, 1:17pm

Here is one Log-Dump of such a failed Request - it’s working through all the Challenges - when they are all valid it’s firing the Request to FINALIZE - which itself returns the 403 - Order Status VALID not acceptable …

Logger Cache: 2020-03-18 01:25:01 [info] Getting list of URLs for API
2020-03-18 01:25:02 [info] Requesting new nonce for client communication
2020-03-18 01:25:02 [info] Account already registered. Continuing.
2020-03-18 01:25:02 [info] Sending registration to letsencrypt server
2020-03-18 01:25:02 [info] Sending signed request to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/new-acct
2020-03-18 01:25:04 [info] Account: https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/acct/*****
2020-03-18 01:25:04 [info] Starting certificate generation process for domains
2020-03-18 01:25:04 [info] Requesting challenge for apartments-fieberbrunn.tirol.in.futurecms.at, www.apartments-fieberbrunn.tirol.in.futurecms.at, apartments-fieberbrunn.tirol.ex.futurecms.at, www.apartments-fieberbrunn.tirol.ex.futurecms.at, apartments-fieberbrunn.tirol.ex.ortsinfo.at, www.apartments-fieberbrunn.tirol.ex.ortsinfo.at, apartments-fieberbrunn.tirol.dev.futurecms.at, www.apartments-fieberbrunn.tirol.dev.futurecms.at
2020-03-18 01:25:04 [info] Sending signed request to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/new-order
2020-03-18 01:25:05 [info] Sending signed request to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/authz-v3/3418921202
2020-03-18 01:25:07 [info] Got challenge token for apartments-fieberbrunn.tirol.dev.futurecms.at
2020-03-18 01:25:07 [info] Token for apartments-fieberbrunn.tirol.dev.futurecms.at saved at /path/to/.well-known/acme-challenge/3ZITFad1qbIFMgVKKoYbSvSlknRoze5SwoX4UCcx53w and should be available at http://apartments-fieberbrunn.tirol.dev.futurecms.at/.well-known/acme-challenge/3ZITFad1qbIFMgVKKoYbSvSlknRoze5SwoX4UCcx53w
2020-03-18 01:25:07 [info] Sending request to challenge
2020-03-18 01:25:07 [info] Sending signed request to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/chall-v3/3418921202/wuM2_A
2020-03-18 01:25:08 [info] Verification pending, sleeping 1s
2020-03-18 01:25:09 [info] Sending signed request to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/chall-v3/3418921202/wuM2_A
2020-03-18 01:25:12 [info] Verification pending, sleeping 5s
2020-03-18 01:25:17 [info] Sending signed request to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/chall-v3/3418921202/wuM2_A
2020-03-18 01:25:19 [info] Verification pending, sleeping 10s
2020-03-18 01:25:29 [info] Sending signed request to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/chall-v3/3418921202/wuM2_A
2020-03-18 01:25:30 [info] Verification pending, sleeping 20s
2020-03-18 01:25:50 [info] Sending signed request to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/chall-v3/3418921202/wuM2_A
2020-03-18 01:25:51 [info] Verification ended with status: valid
2020-03-18 01:25:51 [info] Sending signed request to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/authz-v3/3418921206
2020-03-18 01:25:52 [info] Got challenge token for apartments-fieberbrunn.tirol.ex.futurecms.at
2020-03-18 01:25:52 [info] Token for apartments-fieberbrunn.tirol.ex.futurecms.at saved at /path/to/.well-known/acme-challenge/_qFn9sb3YDA4QVnXB3boPfRGJnwTfvyOKzdgeBI2cC4 and should be available at http://apartments-fieberbrunn.tirol.ex.futurecms.at/.well-known/acme-challenge/_qFn9sb3YDA4QVnXB3boPfRGJnwTfvyOKzdgeBI2cC4
2020-03-18 01:25:52 [info] Sending request to challenge
2020-03-18 01:25:52 [info] Sending signed request to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/chall-v3/3418921206/Z4aORg
2020-03-18 01:25:53 [info] Verification pending, sleeping 1s
2020-03-18 01:25:54 [info] Sending signed request to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/chall-v3/3418921206/Z4aORg
2020-03-18 01:25:55 [info] Verification pending, sleeping 5s
2020-03-18 01:26:00 [info] Sending signed request to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/chall-v3/3418921206/Z4aORg
2020-03-18 01:26:01 [info] Verification pending, sleeping 10s
2020-03-18 01:26:11 [info] Sending signed request to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/chall-v3/3418921206/Z4aORg
2020-03-18 01:26:12 [info] Verification pending, sleeping 20s
2020-03-18 01:26:32 [info] Sending signed request to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/chall-v3/3418921206/Z4aORg
2020-03-18 01:26:33 [info] Verification ended with status: valid
2020-03-18 01:26:33 [info] Sending signed request to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/authz-v3/3418921209
2020-03-18 01:26:34 [info] Got challenge token for apartments-fieberbrunn.tirol.ex.ortsinfo.at
2020-03-18 01:26:34 [info] Token for apartments-fieberbrunn.tirol.ex.ortsinfo.at saved at /path/to/.well-known/acme-challenge/KkDrE9mZrYcOHsN_WpPQa9si5N5puHufE8e0pIAJyIE and should be available at http://apartments-fieberbrunn.tirol.ex.ortsinfo.at/.well-known/acme-challenge/KkDrE9mZrYcOHsN_WpPQa9si5N5puHufE8e0pIAJyIE
2020-03-18 01:26:34 [info] Sending request to challenge
2020-03-18 01:26:34 [info] Sending signed request to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/chall-v3/3418921209/NQR76Q
2020-03-18 01:26:35 [info] Verification pending, sleeping 1s
2020-03-18 01:26:36 [info] Sending signed request to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/chall-v3/3418921209/NQR76Q
2020-03-18 01:26:37 [info] Verification pending, sleeping 5s
2020-03-18 01:26:42 [info] Sending signed request to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/chall-v3/3418921209/NQR76Q
2020-03-18 01:26:42 [info] Verification pending, sleeping 10s
2020-03-18 01:26:53 [info] Sending signed request to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/chall-v3/3418921209/NQR76Q
2020-03-18 01:26:53 [info] Verification pending, sleeping 20s
2020-03-18 01:27:13 [info] Sending signed request to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/chall-v3/3418921209/NQR76Q
2020-03-18 01:27:14 [info] Verification ended with status: valid
2020-03-18 01:27:14 [info] Sending signed request to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/authz-v3/3418921211
2020-03-18 01:27:15 [info] Got challenge token for apartments-fieberbrunn.tirol.in.futurecms.at
2020-03-18 01:27:15 [info] Token for apartments-fieberbrunn.tirol.in.futurecms.at saved at /path/to/.well-known/acme-challenge/-9NvRNz90mqx68_GkIEqW_kBsFAYtPI-7Zl17q5NOI8 and should be available at http://apartments-fieberbrunn.tirol.in.futurecms.at/.well-known/acme-challenge/-9NvRNz90mqx68_GkIEqW_kBsFAYtPI-7Zl17q5NOI8
2020-03-18 01:27:15 [info] Sending request to challenge
2020-03-18 01:27:15 [info] Sending signed request to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/chall-v3/3418921211/cAoBnQ
2020-03-18 01:27:16 [info] Verification pending, sleeping 1s
2020-03-18 01:27:17 [info] Sending signed request to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/chall-v3/3418921211/cAoBnQ
2020-03-18 01:27:18 [info] Verification pending, sleeping 5s
2020-03-18 01:27:23 [info] Sending signed request to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/chall-v3/3418921211/cAoBnQ
2020-03-18 01:27:24 [info] Verification pending, sleeping 10s
2020-03-18 01:27:34 [info] Sending signed request to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/chall-v3/3418921211/cAoBnQ
2020-03-18 01:27:35 [info] Verification pending, sleeping 20s
2020-03-18 01:27:55 [info] Sending signed request to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/chall-v3/3418921211/cAoBnQ
2020-03-18 01:27:56 [info] Verification ended with status: valid
2020-03-18 01:27:56 [info] Sending signed request to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/authz-v3/3418921213
2020-03-18 01:27:56 [info] Got challenge token for www.apartments-fieberbrunn.tirol.dev.futurecms.at
2020-03-18 01:27:56 [info] Token for www.apartments-fieberbrunn.tirol.dev.futurecms.at saved at /path/to/.well-known/acme-challenge/avCoFxkSAvbdHPyEfqCclRAgrxiZBTxeIfl1651_rS0 and should be available at http://www.apartments-fieberbrunn.tirol.dev.futurecms.at/.well-known/acme-challenge/avCoFxkSAvbdHPyEfqCclRAgrxiZBTxeIfl1651_rS0
2020-03-18 01:27:56 [info] Sending request to challenge
2020-03-18 01:27:56 [info] Sending signed request to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/chall-v3/3418921213/iX_zgA
2020-03-18 01:27:57 [info] Verification pending, sleeping 1s
2020-03-18 01:27:58 [info] Sending signed request to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/chall-v3/3418921213/iX_zgA
2020-03-18 01:27:59 [info] Verification pending, sleeping 5s
2020-03-18 01:28:04 [info] Sending signed request to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/chall-v3/3418921213/iX_zgA
2020-03-18 01:28:05 [info] Verification pending, sleeping 10s
2020-03-18 01:28:15 [info] Sending signed request to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/chall-v3/3418921213/iX_zgA
2020-03-18 01:28:16 [info] Verification pending, sleeping 20s
2020-03-18 01:28:36 [info] Sending signed request to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/chall-v3/3418921213/iX_zgA
2020-03-18 01:28:37 [info] Verification ended with status: valid
2020-03-18 01:28:37 [info] Sending signed request to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/authz-v3/3418921216
2020-03-18 01:28:38 [info] Got challenge token for www.apartments-fieberbrunn.tirol.ex.futurecms.at
2020-03-18 01:28:38 [info] Token for www.apartments-fieberbrunn.tirol.ex.futurecms.at saved at /path/to/.well-known/acme-challenge/EbuCl_o5McVwXb0pGFCZmSvYw-MnwLH6WeJgMedRF0U and should be available at http://www.apartments-fieberbrunn.tirol.ex.futurecms.at/.well-known/acme-challenge/EbuCl_o5McVwXb0pGFCZmSvYw-MnwLH6WeJgMedRF0U
2020-03-18 01:28:38 [info] Sending request to challenge
2020-03-18 01:28:38 [info] Sending signed request to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/chall-v3/3418921216/YVYh6A
2020-03-18 01:28:39 [info] Verification pending, sleeping 1s
2020-03-18 01:28:40 [info] Sending signed request to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/chall-v3/3418921216/YVYh6A
2020-03-18 01:28:41 [info] Verification pending, sleeping 5s
2020-03-18 01:28:46 [info] Sending signed request to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/chall-v3/3418921216/YVYh6A
2020-03-18 01:28:47 [info] Verification pending, sleeping 10s
2020-03-18 01:28:57 [info] Sending signed request to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/chall-v3/3418921216/YVYh6A
2020-03-18 01:28:57 [info] Verification pending, sleeping 20s
2020-03-18 01:29:17 [info] Sending signed request to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/chall-v3/3418921216/YVYh6A
2020-03-18 01:29:18 [info] Verification ended with status: valid
2020-03-18 01:29:18 [info] Sending signed request to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/authz-v3/3418921220
2020-03-18 01:29:19 [info] Got challenge token for www.apartments-fieberbrunn.tirol.ex.ortsinfo.at
2020-03-18 01:29:19 [info] Token for www.apartments-fieberbrunn.tirol.ex.ortsinfo.at saved at /path/to/.well-known/acme-challenge/BvoHfTbEkhYyfrZcW-jDxOSvzahX9ScvijGHRkUQbbs and should be available at http://www.apartments-fieberbrunn.tirol.ex.ortsinfo.at/.well-known/acme-challenge/BvoHfTbEkhYyfrZcW-jDxOSvzahX9ScvijGHRkUQbbs
2020-03-18 01:29:19 [info] Sending request to challenge
2020-03-18 01:29:19 [info] Sending signed request to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/chall-v3/3418921220/VGHXnQ
2020-03-18 01:29:20 [info] Verification pending, sleeping 1s
2020-03-18 01:29:21 [info] Sending signed request to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/chall-v3/3418921220/VGHXnQ
2020-03-18 01:29:22 [info] Verification pending, sleeping 5s
2020-03-18 01:29:27 [info] Sending signed request to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/chall-v3/3418921220/VGHXnQ
2020-03-18 01:29:28 [info] Verification pending, sleeping 10s
2020-03-18 01:29:38 [info] Sending signed request to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/chall-v3/3418921220/VGHXnQ
2020-03-18 01:29:39 [info] Verification pending, sleeping 20s
2020-03-18 01:29:59 [info] Sending signed request to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/chall-v3/3418921220/VGHXnQ
2020-03-18 01:30:00 [info] Verification ended with status: valid
2020-03-18 01:30:00 [info] Sending signed request to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/authz-v3/3418921224
2020-03-18 01:30:00 [info] Got challenge token for www.apartments-fieberbrunn.tirol.in.futurecms.at
2020-03-18 01:30:00 [info] Token for www.apartments-fieberbrunn.tirol.in.futurecms.at saved at /path/to/.well-known/acme-challenge/M7BFni7C6Pv4UwEousPod4djVun4MVKj-ddmpa-1qeE and should be available at http://www.apartments-fieberbrunn.tirol.in.futurecms.at/.well-known/acme-challenge/M7BFni7C6Pv4UwEousPod4djVun4MVKj-ddmpa-1qeE
2020-03-18 01:30:01 [info] Sending request to challenge
2020-03-18 01:30:01 [info] Sending signed request to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/chall-v3/3418921224/lN9RnA
2020-03-18 01:30:01 [info] Verification pending, sleeping 1s
2020-03-18 01:30:02 [info] Sending signed request to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/chall-v3/3418921224/lN9RnA
2020-03-18 01:30:03 [info] Verification pending, sleeping 5s
2020-03-18 01:30:08 [info] Sending signed request to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/chall-v3/3418921224/lN9RnA
2020-03-18 01:30:10 [info] Verification pending, sleeping 10s
2020-03-18 01:30:20 [info] Sending signed request to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/chall-v3/3418921224/lN9RnA
2020-03-18 01:30:21 [info] Verification pending, sleeping 20s
2020-03-18 01:30:41 [info] Sending signed request to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/chall-v3/3418921224/lN9RnA
2020-03-18 01:30:42 [info] Verification ended with status: valid
2020-03-18 01:30:42 [info] Sending signed request to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/finalize/2188868/2691206533

403
{
  "type": "urn:ietf:params:acme:error:orderNotReady",
  "detail": "Order's status (\"valid\") is not acceptable for finalization",
  "status": 403
}

#0 /path/to/includes/lescript/OISSL_ACME2_Lescript.php(583): Analogic\ACME\Client->curl('POST', 'https://acme-v0...', '{"protected":"e...')
#1 /path/to/includes/lescript/OISSL_ACME2_Lescript.php(457): Analogic\ACME\Client->post('https://acme-v0...', '{"protected":"e...')
#2 /path/to/includes/lescript/OISSL_ACME2_Lescript.php(244): Analogic\ACME\OISSL_Lescript->signedRequest('https://acme-v0...', Array)
#3 /path/to/includes/cronjobs/sslManager.php(337): Analogic\ACME\OISSL_Lescript->signDomains(Array)
#4 {main}

9peppe · March 18, 2020, 1:29pm

It looks like there’s a certificate issued:

https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/order/2188868/2691206533

futureweb · March 18, 2020, 1:34pm

yes it’s issued - but the call to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/finalize/2188868/2691206533 first returns me the 403 Error which leads to Script Termination which leads to never getting this Cert …
So I try to find out WHY it’s returning the “Order’s status (“valid”) is not acceptable for finalization” Error on first call to finalize Endpoint …

I can and will add checks to the /order/ Endpoint if it’s READY - and only then sent out the finalization Call … but first I want to understand WHY this is happening …

9peppe · March 18, 2020, 1:37pm

and this puzzles me. what's boulder signing, if you aren't sending a csr?

futureweb · March 18, 2020, 1:39pm

what makes you think it’s not sending the CSR - of course it’s sending the CSR within the call to /finalize/ Endpoint … otherwise it wouldn’t work …
it’s working fine … on dozens of renews a day there are only 0-2 such Errors … but of course I want to get rid of them …

9peppe · March 18, 2020, 1:41pm

because that error message tells me "you sent a csr in the past, and I signed it. I am rejecting this newer one."

is it always the same, or completely random?

futureweb · March 18, 2020, 1:45pm

mmhhhh - it’s completely random … if I trigger a renew on the same Cert a few seconds later it’s working fine …
I just added some more debug to the Logs … now I’m saving the whole “/order/” Response before sending to the “/finalize/” Endoint … let’s see what it’s returning (well - I guess it will return Status VALID - as the Error tells me … lol)

Of course I could blindly add the Loop to wait for READY … but that’s not helping me understand what excactly is happening …

futureweb · March 18, 2020, 1:47pm

as for the CSR:

$reuseCsr = false when Func is called - so no reuse CSR

$csr = $reuseCsr && is_file($domainPath . "/last.csr")?
            $this->getCsrContent($domainPath . "/last.csr") :
            $this->generateCSR($privateDomainKey, $domains);

$finalizeResponse = $this->signedRequest($finalizeUrl, array('csr' => $csr));

9peppe · March 18, 2020, 1:50pm

I really have no clue, at this point I might try fetching the order object with each action, and check at what point it changes status.

futureweb · March 18, 2020, 1:51pm

hehe - good i’m not alone with not seeing the Error on this …
Will try to narrow it down with some more debug … will report back when the Error is triggered the next time with more Debug Data … thx for your help!

JuergenAuer · March 18, 2020, 2:06pm

That log looks curious.

Two rows:

2020-03-18 01:25:04 [info] Sending signed request to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/new-order
2020-03-18 01:25:05 [info] Sending signed request to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/authz-v3/3418921202

Why isn’t there the result of the order? Looks like you use older authorizations.

Add some debug outputs of your order

https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/order/2188868/2691206533

Then you see the status and you see, if there is a certificate.

And the code looks buggy.

2020-03-18 01:29:19 [info] Sending request to challenge
2020-03-18 01:29:19 [info] Sending signed request to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/chall-v3/3418921220/VGHXnQ
2020-03-18 01:29:20 [info] Verification pending, sleeping 1s
2020-03-18 01:29:21 [info] Sending signed request to https://acme-v02.api.letsencrypt.org/acme/chall-v3/3418921220/VGHXnQ

If you have created the challenges:

confirm all challenges
then wait 5 seconds.
Then a loop checking the first / second / third challenge

Your code:

Loop

confirm one challenge
wait until checked
GoTo next challenge
EndLoop

Topic		Replies	Views
Order's status ("valid") is not acceptable for finalization Help	3	3792	November 3, 2019
Error when finalizing order Client dev	5	7421	November 21, 2019
Python, how to respond to 'Order's status ("valid") is not acceptable for finalization' Help	9	1987	June 21, 2019
Error when finalizing the order Client dev	6	1183	May 2, 2020
Order's status ("invalid") is not acceptable for finalization Help	5	5524	February 7, 2019

Order's status ("valid") is not acceptable for finalization

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